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We have 16K /22 for distribution in the final /8, all CI assignments we made are just about 100*/24, there is just a little impact to the final /8.
Technically, there are many option to operate TLDs, of course, they can use space from their upstreams, they can even rent the whole facility from a provider too...
The thing we propose is to give them options as what we are doing currently, what do we gain by keeping them from getting portable assignments?
Regards
Terence Zhang
----- Original Message ----- From: "Randy Bush" randy@psg.com To: "Terence Zhang YH" zhangyinghao@cnnic.cn Cc: "Philip Smith" pfs@cisco.com; sig-policy@lists.apnic.net Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 12:42 AM Subject: Re: [sig-policy] prop-085: Eligibility for critical infrastructure assignments from the final /8
ICANN recent launched Internationalized Domain Name country code TLDs (IDN ccTLDs) Fast Track Process and there are ongoing discussion on new generic top-level domain (gTLDs) programs, we can expect dozens of IDN ccTLDs and gTLDs will be created in the next few years. Those new TLD operators may not have existing IPv4 addresses.
and, along with a million other folk, they will learn that ipv4 has run out.
what is it people don't get about GONE, NO MORE, WE'RE OUT, THERE ARE NONE, WE AIN'T GOT ANY, ...?
they can use space from their upstreams. i am sure they will figure it out.
[ unless, as pfs points out, they qaulify under the final /8 policy ]
randy

We have 16K /22 for distribution in the final /8, all CI assignments we made are just about 100*/24, there is just a little impact to the final /8.
for the final /8, we could reproduce every pre-run-out distribution policy. and then it is gone.
we made a contract with ourselves over the final /8, no more distribution except as written in that policy, one current minimal allocation per entity, period, end, forever, stop. and here we are a year later, even before the run-out, already proposing to go back on that contract. it is embarrassing.
Technically, there are many option to operate TLDs, of course, they can use space from their upstreams, they can even rent the whole facility from a provider too...
yep. though, i would just outsource to netnod, the i root folk.
The thing we propose is to give them options as what we are doing currently
they have options. you propose to give them the 'seed corn' and violate the agreement over the last /8 as yet another option. if they need more options, why not also offer them 218.241.97.0/24? (cnnic home)? get the picture?
and "as we are doing currently" is a fantasy after run-out. as i said, what is it people don't get about GONE, NO MORE, WE'RE OUT, THERE ARE NONE, WE AIN'T GOT ANY, ...?
what do we gain by keeping them from getting portable assignments?
the question is what do we lose? the answer is the the use of that space for post run-out new entrants as we agreed in the final /8.
yes, each proposal to violate the last /8 agreement will have a sad story of need. and each will be only a small chunk. and then add them up. we agreed not to do this.
the fact is this is not a real need and there is no more ipv4. we need to really believe and understand that in our hearts.
randy

Any new business that's about to start operations needs to look at all the risks and constraints that apply to them as part of their business plan. If they don't understand that constructing a business model based on IPv4 address space doesn't deserve to succeed in my view.
The imminent exhaustion of IPv4 should be one of those constraints and I thought our final /8 policy was constructed so that the boundaries would be clear and unambiguous to everyone - existing and new users.
There have been several policy proposals since we agreed the final /8 policy that have tried to create corner cases and I just wish we'd stop trying to do this.
I'll repeat my view that this group should be focussed on policy initiatives that promote and support the deployment of IPv6 where they are needed.
Perhaps a sig-policy meeting where there were no proposals tabled might be one way to measure success!

Perhaps a sig-policy meeting where there were no proposals tabled might be one way to measure success!
as long as you do not take the american version of 'tabled' (postponed). :)
randy

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Hi,
One question that this proposal does raise is the minimum allocation from the last /8. The last /8 policy makes it explicit that the minimum allocation is /22.
If for example, someone comes along and asks for a /24 (for multihoming, ccTLD, IXPs, whatever..), would it still make sense to require them to justify a /23 and give them a /22.
Thoughts ?
- -gaurab
- --

One question that this proposal does raise is the minimum allocation from the last /8. The last /8 policy makes it explicit that the minimum allocation is /22.
it does not. it says the then minimum allocation.
If for example, someone comes along and asks for a /24 (for multihoming, ccTLD, IXPs, whatever..), would it still make sense to require them to justify a /23 and give them a /22.
actually, i have proposed to terence that he and i write a proposal to reduce the minimum allocation to /24 when the last /8 days arrive.
randy

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On 8/25/10 4:07 AM, Randy Bush wrote:
actually, i have proposed to terence that he and i write a proposal to reduce the minimum allocation to /24 when the last /8 days arrive.
My thinking as well. I support this approach rather then writing policies for corner cases.
- -gaurab
- --

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Gaurab Raj Upadhaya wrote:
On 8/25/10 4:07 AM, Randy Bush wrote:
actually, i have proposed to terence that he and i write a proposal to reduce the minimum allocation to /24 when the last /8 days arrive.
My thinking as well. I support this approach rather then writing policies for corner cases.
This is a much better idea.
I haven't heard anyone speak out in first person yet though... so I really don't understand if there really is a need. But then again, what do I know...I like this better.
Regards, Seiichi
-gaurab
--
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